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Thank you!  I suppose I was just really ranting.  I shouldnt let this stuff get to me

Hello Dave, read below. I have a site ranking for the cheap SEO term above and I am claiming it has low quality links to it, because I built them.  It's a rinse and repeat site to get some quick clients.  Maybe I should of put this before, but I thought others would have analyzed them quickly with some tools to see this.  Anyways read my last paragraph at the bottom of this page. Annsmarty is also posting an article of mine on one of her sites very soon about this site and how it ranked with no onpage SEO, with terrible backlinks, with 35 pages of duplicate content, a free template, etc, etc, etc... The list keeps going on.  I did everything wrong that according to Google says you will get small penalties. Anyways, I know for a fact that Google didn't update this correctly, because I have many sites I tested that should have failed, but are ranking great in the SERPS right now.   I was counting on them getting penalized to insure that these updates went through correctly, but they didn't .  I utilized the spammiest links I could get like blog comments, forum links, and many others.  I am ranking for some terms that get 20k + exact hits a month with those tactics still....  Something isn't right.  I guess I will take it though, even though they are dummy sites with no adsense setup etc.. They aren't even real sites, the contact us pages aren't working.. Maybe the update isn't done, or I hope it's not. Also to add, I have cross analysis's for 440 sites now that we recorded before the updates happened.  We have new data now, we also have our own self built programs, not many, but we do have some that we have used in the past.  I can cross analyze the onpage SEO factors for 100 sites at once easily and get results on the average onpage SEO densites of keywords they are ranking for.  What we do is take the top 10 from 10 different keywords and enter them in, it will then spit out an average density of the terms.

Thank you, Dan! We have indeed been very transparent about the repercussions of not being indexed. Appreciate you taking the time to respond.

This kind of link building is a real trap. You must pay every month for these links and we all know that soon or later Google finds out how to take down this network. Besides you will loose your money, you risk to be penalized.

Hey Tim I just stumbled over this post so it's a late answer, however, maybe worth throwing in my tuppence / five cents here. I think we are pretty much at the point with all of this that if a small business client comes to you and asks for links then they likely have a bigger problem than actually just needing a bit of a boost for a few keywords. If your client is thinking about buying links to simply do better in search then rather than just pointing them towards someone who may (or may not) do a good job the better advice would be pointing them towards a consultant who help them devise a real strategy. Buying links is not a strategy. If I think about all of the clients I have worked with this year I don't think I have thought a single time - well, what you need is just a few more links. And, often, even when someone may come to us asking for us to build links, we more often than not try to look at ways to do something bigger and better. I guess the point I am trying to make here is to ask the question - why? Why do you want links? What is the real goal? No business thinks we will make it this year if we can just get some more links so what is the real need here. It's just too much of a can of worms to look at possibles but in many cases a well placed guest post on a highly visible site may generate more exposure and qualified click through traffic than the benefit that ten links may bring. Some, stealthy placement on high ranking industry directories may help raise the profile and get more click through traffic again. Some well placed citations and local SEO may be more than enough for many a small business or local business. The possibilities are kind of endless but usually, links are not the entire answer and in many cases are not the biggest part of it. Obviously, it all depends, but the point I am making is often, if they are asking for links, and you really want to give them some help, first ask them why and then try to direct them towards someone who can help them devise a real strategy that will drive exposure, referral traffic and likely a few bang-up links as part of the process. Obviously, on the dawn of Penguin 2.0 (4.0?) having a strategy that is not built around getting more links is even more important than ever. Not an answer as such, but hopefully food for thought!  Marcus

I don't know who told you to remove pipes from titles since it has been a while seos normally uses them in titles, since they helps to separate sentences better than a full stop or comma. Aboutthe order, you want your main keywords at the beginning of the title. I'll add the name of your site just if the two are true: your title is still less than 70 characters long. If you add the name of your company and it's not showing, your just diluting the density of your title without achieving your goal (branding) your company is renown. Having the name of the company helps to enhance ctr if the company is renown, but if you're not so famous, I'll choose to have more dense and focused titles without diluting their value with not useful company names Hope that helps!

Awesome story. Thanks for sharing a real world experience. It's so important to go with a description that companies and marketing departments will understand.

Thanks guys I try to keep up on the followings on a few forum sites along with some youtube subscriptions, I been using them to teach myself what I can. I'm actually more of a web developer than a SEO but my boss is wanting me to do a more on the SEO side.  I enjoy both side to my job and I'm not intending on giving up on either any-time soon unless they have no need for an apprentice anymore. I'm having more of an issue with practical application at the minute, I get time during the week to do my research but I also have to attempt to improve some sites I'v created, I like to think I'm doing a good job on them (I'm probably not haha) but I'm starting to struggle with things like how to do effective link analysis which isn't something I feel like I can read about and then know what I'm doing. I learn best by watching and doing which I'm finding hard within the smoke and mirrors that is SEO haha.

Hooray! See you then.

Hi Tom, I know, we always make sure that we are doing ethical link building and to ensure the quality is high then you get some cowboy SEO-ers doing this and getting rewarded for it!! I guess I just have to put my hopes in Google and the fact that they'll (one day!) figure them out and all will be well!! I can hope anyway!

Thanks Lynn!!

Even Step2 from baidu.com didn't help: <a id="s2" name="s2"></a>Step 2: Click "Sitemap", add new data. http://www.baidu.com/search/sitemap_help.html

I definitely have seen some drops in wiki over the last 6 month or so.  Anyone else?

I understand that you got some parameters in the url since you need them to recognize the product. Just put a canonical to the generic contact us page and you're done. Be sure that those parameters will be not carried over in other pages. In that sennse you'll better set up a self referring canonical on all pages so you'll avoid any dupe issue in the future.

Hi Keri.....there is no message from google webmaster and there has been a drop in ORGANIC traffic only from Google . Will look for an answer .

Not me personally, but had a buddy who used Info Cubic for PPC management/SEO and was satisfied with the results.

Thank i did that six months ago

I recommend Matt, Oleg and the guys/gals at http://melen.net/  Matt and Oleg are pro members here as well. (http://www.seomoz.org/users/profile/357534)  Hope that helps!

I forgot content skills. Good writing/content skills would be included. Thanks

Good point Keri - I think it would probably be appropriate to have a link to this as well http://www.business.ftc.gov/documents/bus61-can-spam-act-compliance-guide-business