SEOMoz is ripping everyone off.
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***Note from Jen 4/6/11:
I've deleted the text of this question as it goes against our guidelines by putting down other people and ranting as opposed to asking a question. I left the original question up for about 24 hours before removing.
The comments are great though so I didn't want to delete the thread altogether.
Thanks!
Jen Lopez
Community Manager, SEOmoz -
SEO does work. I've gained thousands of top rankings on through effective SEO strategies, and many others here have done the same or better.
"spending thousands of dollars and doing everything possible, I don't even have one keyword in the top 50 after about 5 months of keyword optimization and SEO"
Many of us would be happy to provide you some guidance if you would like help!
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Thanks for taking the time to give us feedback, however Q&A is a place to ask questions and learn from one another. It is not a place to go off on rants whether it's about SEOmoz, any person or any other company. We are all about getting feedback from customers, but let's focus on doing in a productive way that can be beneficial to everyone involved. I won't be removing this post as there are some great things that can come of it.
For the other readers, I have emailed the author directly to get more information. I'd love to take this opportunity for the community to help him out and talk about how SEO has helped your company to grow. Come on, let's hear your answers!
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Dealing with your points in order
This website is dead? - Not if you look into the stats over the increased number of people signing up for the Pro service.
SEO is dead? - I must hear that at least once a fortnight but have been hearing it for 4 years and its still here, I'm getting paid by a global company to work in-house on their sites as well as working freelance for local businesses and have got results via SEO so can't agree with you on this one.
If you only have one keyword in the top 50 then you probably haven't done everything possible. Could it be that you don't really know what you are doing so your results aren't matching expectations? Sorry if that seems harsh but signing up to SEO Moz pro doesn't make you an instant expert.
Regarding the new Q&A system - I like it, I can still ask a private question to one of the experts or I can put a question out there for the collective minds of a few SEO's to provide answers. Often in SEO there is more than one way and more than one answer so its interesting to get a range of opinions. I also get to help others with their SEO issues which is something I enjoy doing.
It sounds like you are annoyed as you spent ages writing 500 articles and got nowhere and haven't realised that this probably isn't the best strategy. You say you have spent thousands of dollars but for that you could have employed a decent SEO consultant to help you.
You sound annoyed that Rand is making lots of money....sounds like jealousy to me. If he is then well done to him. He and his colleagues provide lots of interesting actionable insight that have helped a number of SEO's help their clients. Should they give both this and the software aware for free?
If even one person is swayed by your rant I will be surprised especially when they see that you call yourself BigJohnson.
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I didn't just write 500 articles. I have had many employees working for me and that is where the money mostly went, as well as my time. I have tried everything in the book and consider myself an expert on the concepts of SEO. As well as this, I followed current SEO news with Google Newsreader and Google Alerts on a daily basis. My schedule was 8PM to 4AM after work 5 days a week. I read everything I could and tried out many tools. I feel like I know the ins and outs of SEO like the back of my hand. I can't tell you how many directory submissions we have made (myself and my employees).
Here is the problem. The problem is I feel strongly that SEO is dead. The reason is because Google doesn't want you to be able to pay to improve your rankings. Google is giving precedence to companies who have been around for a long time and naturally deserve the highest rankings. There is no way for a new or small company to compete with that.
I have tried every method I know of to get ranked and I have no words of value in the top 50. I feel that the only people making money are people selling how to make money or SEO services. Once the client realizes this it will be too late and the SEO expert will have made too much money at this point.
Here is what I am getting at. I feel that this is exactly like Jim Cramer on Mad Money. Rand Fishkin is making money the same way, he is giving people false hopes and then making money off of it.
All of these articles and blogs on here are worthless because it is so difficult to rank in the first place who gives a damn about those small nuances of title this, backlink that.
The only people making money are those selling how to make money or SEO services...
Tell me I am wrong, tell me how to get ranked. But I have tried everything in the book and I can't get ranked for any valuable keyword.
The only thing I haven't tried is buying links, maybe I should try that?
Or maybe since my domain was parked before I bought it google is penalizing me?
Or maybe I am in the supplemental index?
Who knows, this is a losing battle and I feel ripped off.
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I can understand your frustration, but this isn't the way to go about getting it resolved. Please respond to my email right away.
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I'm a very small fish in the SEO world, but managing to achieve rankings, traffic and conversions on a number of sites by following the basic principles, so don't believe that SEO is dead.
With so much work and effort, if you don't even have a single keyword in the Top 50, then my first thought is that you have chosen to pursue keywords that are way too competitive. Since you refer to "keywords of value", this seems likely. Maybe a review of your keyword strategy is a possible place to start.
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Dude, you really got me riled up. I hope that doesn't show too badly. Thanks for that, actually, I needed it this morning. I hope my response here helps you find the truth, and profit.
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"I can't tell you how many directory submissions we have made (myself and my employees)."
Perhaps these low value links were the reason your site performed so poorly. This activity may have diluted your link juice, and damaged your site's trust. Too much directory submission looks spammy (especially when you hit up all of them, add yourself to their bad neighborhoods).
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Did you try performing any LDA analysis on the content of your site?
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Did you try seeking links from domains in similar themes to yours?
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Have you done any link profile analysis of the competitors that outrank you?
I am sure you have other things to try besides buying links (which you essentially did try when you hired staff to link build...)
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"All of these articles and blogs on here are worthless because it is so difficult to rank in the first place who gives a damn about those small nuances of title this, backlink that."
Successful SEOs give that damn. SEO is considerably more complex nowadays than it once was. It's not a matter of building a few links here, a few links there, and stuffing keywords in your meta tags and page footer. To be successful at SEO nowadays, you need to understand the nuances of title this, backlink that.
Why is that a surprise? Cultures and technologies develop, evolve, and change. Pre-Meiji Japanese was particularly nuanced, and if you didn't get it right back then, you could have your head cut off, totally legally. Same goes for the Antebellum South -- if you didn't understand the nuances, you and your family could be murdered or enslaved. Even today, nuances rule behavior -- for instance, I can't discuss anything related to Wikileaks with my friends and family in the military; yet can with the world at large, right now. Nuanced, huh?
The world is nuanced. Nuances count. Details matter.
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Dear Johnson
If you can't be patient then SEO if not the right profession for you. Stop acting like a loser and revamp your strategy. Success does not comes overnight. It takes years of hard work and planning.
At the end of the day people who rank higher are "Ordinary guys just like you and me - Only Human". If they can do it then why the hell you can't ?
Chin Up And Get Back To Work!
Rishi
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To one "Big Johnson",
First of all, nice name. Very professional. I showed your post to my team this morning and we had a great laugh! Your claim about SEO being dead absolutely made my day. Obviously, you have no idea what you're doing as far as SEO is concerned, so if I were you, I'd go back to school and get a grasp on the basics.
SEOMoz Pro is an excellent tool and many, many SEOs utilize these tools and have phenomenal results. Don't complain about a companies software...chances are it's not the software that is failing, but the idiots who are trying to use it and have no idea what they're doing.
Again, thanks for giving us a great laugh this morning. I think I might include your claim of SEO is dead in this month's newsletter. I'm sure my client's who have gone from not being ranked at all to number 2 and 3 spots will be thrilled. Thank God for people like you that like to complain when you really have nothing to complain about. Go get schooled son.
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This is great!!! I only wish I hadn't missed the main post before it got deleted!
SEO is dead because you have spent 1000's of man hours submitting to directories. Thats awesome.
I've read tons of books on baseball and watched hundreds of games!!!! I just dont understand why the Yankees refuse to pick me up? I'm a pro!
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Hi BigJohnson,
There are numerous explanations for failure and none for success. Chill out and start doing the things right. Stop submitting in useless directories.
If your team is running towards dead end it is not fault of SEOmoz.
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The fact that you feel like you "know" SEO like the back of your hand, etc.... is a big give-away to your problems, it results in complacency.
I did my final project at uni on SEO, have worked in-house for a large multinational corporation as an SEO, have worked now in an agency for three years doing nothing but SEO, subscribe to every blog that's any good, read every book that's any good, and have done every SEO course in existence that's worth doing, yet I know ABSOLUTELY NOTHING in terms of what their is to know, and I know nothing in comparison to many of the people on these boards. Maybe Mr. BigJohnson, you should consider how much you actually know, rather than how much you think you know before apportioning blame for your own lack of knowledge.
Also, If SEO is dead then why are all of my agency's clients so happy with the results we get them, which increases their revenue... maybe look inwards for the answers to your problems instead of outwards!
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SEO works when done right it will drive traffic to your site, when you pick the right keywords you will have targeted traffic, now on the other hand you must have a website that converts. Conversions are important, just think nice looking site, good content, good calls to action.
A site with visitors and no conversions plus seo = no conversions
A site with 100 visitors and 4% conversion rate = 4 conversions
now you add seo and the site now has 2,000 visitors at 4% = 100 conversions
Getting SEO to to Work
its all simple MATH
but then again
if i sell broken records online doesnt mean anyone will ever search online to buy them even if they rank #1 for buy broken records, and broken records
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Dude, let me run OSE and I'll tell you EXACTLY why you're not ranking. lol!
Anyway, I'll do a site audit for free. Email me your site. By the way, I'm not joking.
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hi magento I am moving towards using magento on a full time basis for ecommerce so I may well need you to improve a printer ink site we are having developed. please PM me.
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You should get a award for most funny awnser hahahahahaha
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What's OSE? I need a site audit...how do you do that?
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Open Site Explorer
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Mr Johnson
as already stated by many of the responses above SEO has changed and is no longer as easy as it once used to be. SEO MOZ is not Google , opensite explorer is only a indication of what the google bot sees. However it is still very possible to rank and to rank on very competitive terms, 3 things needed , TIME + Money + understanding= results the first variable is something a lot of people cant do, Money is dependent on a number of factors ie if you are working for a business , personal project and the overall outcome you are expecting to get , example you may rank top but only in a market thats worth 50p a year , in which case spending £2000 to get top is pointless.
The 3rd is understanding I can teach a monkey the basics of seo , but what that person does with that knowledge is upto them, I have shared my knowledge with several people the ones that embraced it and run with the basic fundamentals of work hard , follow the rules avoid the " rank fast link build program" ( Ive tired them all ) have in most cases surpassed me and now it is I who learns off them .
I know nothing about SEO as it evolves almost daily I think it is almost impossible to keep up , but with having a wider community I am able to access the collective mind and so learn faster. ( knowing nothing has still aloowed me to dominate several very large competitive terms for the last tree to four years. When my web design clients started to ask about seo 5 years ago i was scarred to death if I saw over 100,000 results. But i decided to learn 9 I had to , on the arrival of my first child in order to provide the life I wanted to provide her, My day was the same as your , full time job then home 8pm till 4 am back up at 7 30 am to do the day job.
I failed many many times :)))))))) But that is part of succeeding
Someone has already covered that crap directories will harm your sites trust , I would love to know the domain you are / having been having no luck with.
Success is usual that one step away after most people quit. KEEP GOING (But take on advice that seems to be for coming from several on this thread)
May the force be with YOU
Winners never QUIT , they just understand failing is part of success.
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