SEOMoz is ripping everyone off.
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You've made a good point here, and I agree SEO will only work if its done correctly.
I've only recently joined SEOMoz and started to get involved within the community here, but I can say that you do need a basic grasp of SEO concepts if you're to get the best possible results from the tools available online (by SEOMoz or otherwise).
If you use tools incorrectly or don't understand the data that is being shown to you then its easy to chuck hundreds of pounds into Google advertising and in three months time you might be no better off.
I wasn't able to see your original comment, but I agree with Jennifer Sable Lopez; using the Q+A section to rant about things probably isn't the best use of anybody's time but at least a (mainly) positive discussion has started as a result.
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If only your directory submissions and article marketing got this many natural responses!
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For the record, I'm jealous too. I want to make lots of money like Rand. If only I had a subscription service worth subscribing too...
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I agree with with the sentiment of this post and respect to SEO moz for keeping it live and respect to Big J for having the courage to post a counter argument.
I do beleive that Google's ultimate goal with be to "take out" manual intevention ie SEO consultants have their days numbered...
There is a kind of new age fundamantalist vibe about about some SEO consultants, an arrogant beleif that they can out wit the Google gods. But occassionally out of all the guff an occasional puff of wisdom wafts out of all the hyperbole...
In truth I'm 50% on the SEO train, the other half is cynical...
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"Tell me I am wrong, tell me how to get ranked".
"The only thing I haven't tried is buying links, maybe I should try that?"
"Or maybe since my domain was parked before I bought it google is penalizing me?"
"Or maybe I am in the supplemental index?"
You're the "expert", you should be telling us!
Writing 500 articles and submitting your website to hundreds, even thousands, of directories can actually kill the rep of your site.
"Google is giving precedence to companies who have been around for a long time and naturally deserve the highest rankings. There is no way for a new or small company to compete with that."
To try and compete with these sites is foolish. Would you try and compete with Walmart by opening up your own discount chain? Compete with McDonald's by opening a lousy fast-food burger chain? No. People compete with larger, well-established companies such as McDonald's by creating a better product. By being innovative. You need to offer people something that is new and unique. Sure, it's frustrating as hell at times, but that should only spark new ideas. You can't just throw up an identical product and hope that it picks up and takes off right off the bat. That's why company's throw millions, even billions each year in brand recognition so that when any given consumer thinks of the word "car", they think Toyota (or whatever). You can't just build your own Toyota and hope it competes. You need to go above and beyond what the big boys already have to make your name in any business.
I don't consider myself to be even close to an SEO expert, but I'm quite confident I have a much better understanding than you. Bypass all the directories and article submissions, and focus your efforts on contacting and obtaining backlinks from reputable, relatable websites to yours within the same niche.
How to beat the algo updates is to get your name out there onto high-trafficked websites that can send you a ton of traffic. That way, you don't have to count on the SERP's day in, day out.
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My first invitation to you would be to identify and subsequently throw out all your assumptions you seem to be quite commited to.
Google does't want you to pay to improve your rankings"
You know this to be true how? If you truly believe this and some of the other things you wrote in your post I can't help but get the impression that your definition of SEO is gaming (tricking) Google.
Instead maybe focus on creating high quality content worthy to be ranked and helping Google fullfil it's mission by providing relevant search results.
Hence why social activity is becoming the dominant factor as it is most likely a measure of quality than the back linking which over the years has grown completely out of control.
No point in doing anything until you maybe change the paradigm you are operating from. Take a breath, meditate a little and see if any of this makes sense.
The support here is out of the world.
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Or as someone told me once, "Everyone can play basketball, " but you don't want everyone on your team.
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SEO Step #1: Good Content
SEO Mistake #1: Thinking Google is about rewarding your SEO efforts
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I am very interested to know something Mr. Johnson. If you believe SEO is dead, what are you doing now instead of SEO to promote your site?
It sounds to me like you were sold on the idea that doing business on the Internet was going to be fast, easy money. Once you found out it was hard work with no guarantee of success, same as starting a business anywhere else (maybe harder), you got ticked off.
Did you give up. Or are you still at it? If you're still at it, now that you've abandoned SEO, what are you doing to be successful with your site?
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SEO works fine for me, though I would guess since you've tried "everything in the book" that you've been reading the wrong book.
I would suggest you try Adwords since that's where Google would like to push everyone, but Adwords is a hell of a lot harder than SEO. If you can't make it here, you certainly won't make it there. My clients do well in both organic and paid search simply by using many of the principles that most people in this form are familiar with. It's not rocket science, but indeed, you have to follow the right advice, "read the correct book," metaphorically speaking. Find out what your competitors are doing and do it better. Then double the effort so they can't catch up.
I can't tell you whose advice to follow, but stay away from gaming the system and build your business with sustainable practices and you'll get there. I'm new as a Pro Member, but from what I can tell SEO Moz is right on the money.
And by the way, one of my clients is in the top 5 most difficult industries for SEO and in the toughest market in the world. They're consistently on the first page for their #1 search term so I know it still works. Hope you stick with it.
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Hey Dino64,
Welcome to SEOmoz!
Sha
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Is -1 Moz Points common? Never seen it.
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Yes, that's what happens when someone gets more downvotes than they have upvotes. It doesn't happen often, but it can definitely happen.
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" I have tried everything in the book and consider myself an expert on the concepts of SEO."
"The problem is I feel strongly that SEO is dead. "
"The only thing I haven't tried is buying links, maybe I should try that?"
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And of course the need for decent content
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When a company employs an SEO to improve site rankings, which invariably is the point initially, they are buying links. Part of the work could be e.g. website structure reorganisation, but paying for content to be added in blog posts, finding lost links, press releases or any process which is manually increasing links for rankings....is buying links. Fact remains links are still important and paying someone to get more links is no better than buying links outright. Manipulating Facebook or Twitter is exactly the same if you pay someone to do it.
Theres a whole unnatural drive for content addition because Google has everybody jumping through hoops..........ive lost count i read reformated, republished, rewritten SEO advice and many other topics. Theres only so many ways you can write the same info. Thats what`s wrong in pleasing Google.
How much content in total online as a percentage is actually worth linking to? .0000001% probably. Writing content that people will link to is nigh impossible.
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SEO is not dead. Why?
I run the oldest, most informative, beautiful website in my niche yet I still get out ranked by spammy sites run by people who know nothing about the niche.
What can I conclude from this? Content is not yet king. If you build it they won't necessarily come. Oh, and SEO is definitely not dead.
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